What if the first level managers actually acted like an ExtremeTeam, instead of like courtiers cutting each others' throats for the attention of the SunK''''''ing? Together they would have stories, planning, pairing, refactoring (reorganization). If asked for help, they would have to say yes. They would set their own estimates. They would communicate directly with the customers' first level managers. Might work, couldn't hurt, worth a try. ---- From ExtremeManagement: : In TomDeMarco's talk at XpImmersionThree (TomsTalkAtXpImmersionThree), he spoke of ManagementTeam's and the fact that there aren't many. LowellLindstrom suggested that such a thing might be just the way to scale XP up. I'll see about drawing a picture and posting it. --RonJeffries ---- '''LeadersAndT''''''eamwork''' RobHarwood make the last update of this page in 2001. He might be interested in a 2005 book "The Driving Force.." (ISBN: 0975263803), seeking a solution to get teamwork out of Alpha Male/Females. Some details at http://www.emediawire.com/releases/2005/1/emw199728.htm Any other resources on related/relevant material?